Attention Businesses - Know Your Rights

[Lawrence]

ATTENTION - UPDATE
Great news! HostBill has made a public statement in regards to older clients.
- http://extras.hostbillapp.com/information-about-pricemodules-changes-in-4-6-0-release-for-current-customers/

HostBill has stated respectfully that they DO respect grandfather rights, and all users prior to version 4.6.0 will continue to receive updates. The below will remain for future reference in an attempt to keep this forum public, and open. It's been a long 24 hours, but HostBill has proven that they are indeed a promising partner in regards to maintaining their promise to clients prior to 4.6.0.






I'm not sure if any of this applies, as I'm not a lawyer and have no legal certifications. These links are here to provide the community with resources in regards to what they may be able to do, and for possibly reducing research time for legal endeavors.

• The following information comes from The European Union Official Website.
• For reference, this website is translated in multiple languages, including Polish.
• Poland is part of the European Union, so it's my understanding that it's also part of the European Union's policies.

The following resources will help you in understanding your consumer rights.

General Resources

• Your Online Rights
• Guarantees
• Repairs, Replacements, Refunds - Would updates be classified as a repair?
• Your Return Rights
• When Buying Services
• Unfair Commercial Practices
• Unfair Treatment - Includes how Hostbill is handling pricing.

Additional Assistance

• Buying Goods & Services
• Getting Help
• Alternative Dispute Resolution
• Alternative Dispute Resolution (In Poland)

Code of EU Online Rights

Highlights & Related Information
- https://ec.europa.eu/digital-agenda/rights-principles-applicable-when-you-buy-goods-or-services-online
- https://ec.europa.eu/digital-agenda/sites/digital-agenda/files/Code%20EU%20online%20rights%20PL%20final.pdf
- https://ec.europa.eu/digital-agenda/sites/digital-agenda/files/Code%20EU%20online%20rights%20EN%20final%202.pdf

This topic / post is not legal advice, but a resource to other websites that possesses legal information.

[Lawrence]

This post was made in response to the recent changes at HostBill regarding how previously included software was removed. Although users who buy HostBill on, or after version 4.6.0 have no legal rights in regards to this, users from 4.5.8 and prior may have legal rights.

The reason these links were pulled is because HostBill refers to this very website (europa.eu) themselves, and so HostBill must have a firm understanding of it's policies regarding how it's business operates.

If you have used all included addons and orderpages, in order to maintain updates for these, you will have to pay an additional $3,697.30. This is a heavy markup from the original pricing model, and not the one everyone here has agreed to. Some have agreed to $199.95, some $399.95, and some a lot more.

You were sold a product with all proposed functionality INCLUDED WITH THE SOFTWARE with LIFETIME UPDATES for some agreements, and ONE YEAR OF UPDATES for other agreements.

[Lawrence]

I'm now unlocking this post so users may respond. I just had to get in those 2 posts. If anyone has any information regarding our rights, please by all means feel free to post. Anyone with legal authority, we'd love to hear from you.

[tallship]

users from 4.5.8 and prior may have legal rights.

May? I realize you're a layperson the same as me, but that offers very little solace.

If you have used all included addons and orderpages, in order to maintain updates for these, you will have to pay an additional $3,697.30. This is a heavy markup from the original pricing model, and not the one everyone here has agreed to.

I don't understand what you're trying to say here Lawrence, it's not quite clear to me. I know YANAL (You Are Not A Lawyer), but are you saying, based upon your research, that kbkp can legally strip out the functionality we purchased w/our lifetime licenses and extort us for the price of the modules that we already have?

If not, are you saying that if we haven't actually activated some/all of the modules included in the original purchase of our software with the lifetime license, that in order to activate them, or begin using them, that kbkp can extort us for the price of those modules when we choose to activate them?

If the word, extort/extortion etc., bothers you, then feel free to s/extort/ream/ or s/extort/bugger/

Some have agreed to $199.95, some $399.95, and some a lot more.

I paid $299 for a lifetime, owned, non-branded license.

You were sold a product with all proposed functionality INCLUDED WITH THE SOFTWARE with LIFETIME UPDATES for some agreements, and ONE YEAR OF UPDATES for other agreements.

My annual subscriptions are theoretically locked in a $45.00/yr



I'm very worried about a time (maybe very soon) when a future update will render the software unusable.

Kindest regards,

[Lawrence]

Thanks for your wisdom Tallship, do you think we're entitled to updates to the software that was included with our licenses prior to these changes? I would love that peace of mind, but in the latest release, unfortunately there were no included updates for the fixes stated in the changelog.

There's just too much legalities to read, and I'm in no position to comprehend all of them.

I don't understand what you're trying to say here Lawrence, it's not quite clear to me. I know YANAL (You Are Not A Lawyer), but are you saying, based upon your research, that kbkp can legally strip out the functionality we purchased w/our lifetime licenses and extort us for the price of the modules that we already have?

If not, are you saying that if we haven't actually activated some/all of the modules included in the original purchase of our software with the lifetime license, that in order to activate them, or begin using them, that kbkp can extort us for the price of those modules when we choose to activate them?

What I meant to say is in order to receive updates for all the order pages and extensions stripped from the current version of HostBill, you would have to pay that much. My apologies! I thought it was clear enough.

[tallship]

Thanks for your wisdom Tallship, do you think we're entitled to updates to the software that was included with our licenses prior to these changes? I would love that peace of mind, but in the latest release, unfortunately there were no included updates for the fixes stated in the changelog.

I think so. I think (I expect) that all of the features of our Hostbill's would continue to include, and that kbkp would be obligated to make sure that updates include, all of the features that were included in the software at least up to 4.5.8.

I actually think we're entitled to any future core features included with the sofware, whatever those features may be, excluding any "extras" that kbkp rolls out separate and independent of the core software product - especially security patches.

But as you point out, and my post HERE seems to indicate, it appears that at least the one bug fix mentioned in the changelog that was so crippling to my business wasn't even dealt with - it appears as if kbkp lied in the changelog, and I'm not paying them $75 for the privilege of knowing I won't get my guaranteed 18hr response as to why.

[Lawrence]

This topic no longer needs discussion as everything's going to be alright. HostBill has made a statement that we will continue to receive updates for all modules prior to 4.6.0.