Past your "30 day refund" window and want a refund? Request a chargeback!

[Patrick]

You would be the exception to the industry. Most hosting companies I know, suspend the account and possible terminate the customer if they receive a chargeback or a PayPal dispute and most inform this in their TOS as well.

I don´t say its not for consumer protection, but usually its meant to protect the cardholder against fraud or unauthorized use. Not as a tool if someone is not happy with a purchase.

Software that has no problems? Please tell me if you know one, because I don´t know a single software bug free.

I didn't read your entire post, i stuck to the points to what we're discussing.  I highlighted above what i'm responding to.

In response:

You are still confused as to the difference.  This is where you're going wrong.  The software is not functioning as advertised and no reasonable means were made to fix them within the 30 day guarantee, never mind in 152 days time.  This is reasonable grounds for a charge back. 

I purchase software all the time and a few bugs may be there.  That happens, but these aren't bugs, it's enough to cause the module, software not to function as advertised

[Lawrence]

I am going to keep my opinions limited regarding this, but I'm on Nibb's side regarding this debate. HostBill has always been very straight forward with providing refunds to their clients, and the two individuals (of many) that I have referred to HostBill which have requested refunds, they were fully compensated. Of course this was prior to the price going up, but nonetheless makes a solid statement. 7 days may not be enough time for everyone to evaluate the software in full, but we have no right to dictate their refund policy.

[Patrick]

I am going to keep my opinions limited regarding this, but I'm on Nibb's side regarding this debate. HostBill has always been very straight forward with providing refunds to their clients, and the two individuals (of many) that I have referred to HostBill which have requested refunds, they were fully compensated. Of course this was prior to the price going up, but nonetheless makes a solid statement. 7 days may not be enough time for everyone to evaluate the software in full, but we have no right to dictate their refund policy.

This is only about modules such as the onApp module that has had tickets open for over a year regarding issues causing the module not to function as advertised.  The point is, if you buy hostbill for billing and one of the advertised modules and that module does not work out of the box and no reasonable effort has been made within the (now 7 days) then a charge back is very reasonable (if KBKP Software refuses refund)

[electric]

Nibb, you are wrong.  Flat out incorrect.  Visa and MasterCard operate worldwide and their chargeback rules and codes are the SAME wordwide.  There are many reasons why a buyer is permitted to file a chargeback.  One of them is if you received defective merchandise or if the product you receive does not work as advertised.

To prove my statement is correct, you merely have to go to your local mastercard or visa website for your region and search for "chargeback codes" (in your language) and you'll find there are a lot of different reasons. 

Here are the reason codes I am suggesting in this situation for:

MasterCard

Reason Code 4853: Cardholder Dispute-Defective/Not as Described

A cardholder returned (or attempted to return) goods or services to a card acceptor for any of the following reasons: goods and services did not conform to their description (quality, workmanship, color, size, or quantity is not as described) or goods arrived broken or could not be used for the intended purpose.

Visa

Reason Code #53 - Not as Described or Defective Merchandise

Good day.

[YesIHaveOne]

There is no morality about charge backs, I agree with this point or disagree with that, matters not, It's a law. I believe charge back timescales are unlimited if you can justify the charge back, 12 months is a more usual timescale that relies on less evidence.

As for the 7 day money back, it's tosh. The law in the UK, which therefore covers Europe too, is the distance selling regulations. You can for whatever reason you like reject goods/service within 30 days of purchase for a _full refund_. So I don't like the colour or the way it works is a perfectly valid reason for a refund. The only exception to this is if the product or service has been customised for you and then it is only allowed to withhold the portion of the fee that is related to the customisation, in our world that might be a setup fee if it could be shown that it had a cost and was not something automatic like a sign up system.

[Paul]

A chargeback is absolutely fair in the case that a service was not delivered (you did not receive free advertised installation service) or the product was not as advertised (VMWare module advertised, WHMCS Import script advertised, etc.), or complete breach of contract. Kris' arbitrary refund policy does not allow him to falsely advertise, we have consumer protection against fraudulent sellers.

So yes, file a chargeback if you fall under any of those 3 categories. Also, having a bug that makes a part of the software defunct that was advertised, but has not been resolved through a ticket... that's defective product, also valid for chargeback.

I also see no mention of the 7 day refund now. No way to ask pre-sales questions, no demo, no refund. People are taking a huge gamble buying HostBill now (I wonder if anyone even is), and so a chargeback is their only protection...

[electric]

I also see no mention of the 7 day refund now.

Yes, it looks like the Hostbill owner (Kris) has just removed the 7-day refund "guarantee".  Lol.  Actually it makes sense, since it is pointless to put any kind of refund date when the purchaser can merely call their bank and request a chargeback if the software doesn't perform as advertised.

(Although of course, I do recommend first trying to contact Hostbill to request a refund.)

[Patrick]

It's things like that that show instability because it was 30 days 4 days ago then 7 days 3 days ago then he wakes up and says let's remove that promotion today (promotion being an artificial refund guarantee). What gets me is he plays the prices and refund guarantee like it's a daily lottery. Buy today and you get................

It's that kind of wild change that has us planning an exit strategy. I know we plan to do the same as Lawrence, and sync backups with our backup option daily when we decide who to go with.

@electric - thank you for providing the visa and Mastercard codes. It was the point I was trying to make with nibb. But as always try with kbkp software first and do it the honorable way first.

[electric]

But as always try with kbkp software first and do it the honorable way first.

Yes, I think it is important for people reading this that they should first try to contact KBKP Hostbill company first and request a refund.  Even if it is 6 months since you purchased you should at least try first.

Then if KBKP company denies your refund request,  (which is owed to you under European Law where the KBKP company is located), you can easily contact your bank and request a chargeback.  Presto.. instant "refund", and KBKP will learn the hard way how the law works as well as how to treat their customers with respect.

[tallship]

If kbkp doesn't have a policy regarding refunds then a chargeback is the correct way to seek remuneration FIRST. If kbkp has a refund policy then a refund request to kbkp is the correct way to seek remuneration FIRST.

Not having a refund policy is asking for chargebacks lol. Even if a moneyback guarantee isn't offered, a refund policy is REQUIRED by payment processors of their merchants.

Having a moneyback guarantee is optional, of course, but not having one means that people won't bother contacting you first and just issue chargebacks instead - costing you, the vendor, money, for each chargeback.

Since the customer WILL get their money back regardless, it's prolly best to have some sort of encouragement for the customer to contact the vendor and at least discuss the matter first... WAIT, that costs $75 lol!

Stupid is as stupid does.